The U.S. Department of Transportation on Thursday, Dec. 22, announced the long-anticipated Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration final rule that revises the hours-of-service safety requirements for commercial truck drivers.
While the final rule retains the current 11-hour daily driving limit — FMCSA previously was in favor of reducing it to 10 hours — it reduces by 12 hours the maximum number of hours a truck driver can work within a week. Under the old rule, truck drivers could work on average up to 82 hours within a seven-day period. The new HOS final rule limits a driver’s work week to 70 hours. FMCSA says it will continue to conduct data analysis and research to further examine any risks associated with the 11 hours of driving time.
In addition, truck drivers cannot drive after working eight hours without first taking a break of at least 30 minutes. Drivers can take the 30-minute break whenever they need rest during the eight-hour window.
The rule also requires truck drivers who maximize their weekly work hours to take at least two nights’ rest when their 24-hour body clock demands sleep the most – from 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. This rest requirement is part of the rule’s “34-hour restart” provision that allows drivers to restart the clock on their work week by taking at least 34 consecutive hours off-duty. The final rule allows drivers to use the restart provision only once during a seven-day period.
Companies and drivers that commit egregious violations of the rule could face the maximum penalties for each offense. Trucking companies that allow drivers to exceed the 11-hour driving limit by 3 or more hours could be fined $11,000 per offense, and the drivers themselves could face civil penalties of up to $2,750 for each offense.
“Trucking is a difficult job, and a big rig can be deadly when a driver is tired and overworked,” said U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood. “This final rule will help prevent fatigue-related truck crashes and save lives. Truck drivers deserve a work environment that allows them to perform their jobs safely.”
As part of the HOS rulemaking process, FMCSA held six public listening sessions across the country and encouraged safety advocates, drivers, truck company owners, law enforcement and the public to share their input on HOS requirements. The listening sessions were live webcast on the FMCSA Website, allowing a broad cross-section of individuals to participate in the development of this safety-critical rule.
“This final rule is the culmination of the most extensive and transparent public outreach effort in our agency’s history,” said FMCSA Administrator Anne Ferro. “With robust input from all areas of the trucking community, coupled with the latest scientific research, we carefully crafted a rule acknowledging that when truckers are rested, alert and focused on safety, it makes our roadways safer.
Industry groups were quick to weigh in and blast FMCSA’s newest measure.
“Even with an uptick in truck-involved fatalities in 2010, since the current rules went into effect in 2004, fatalities have fallen 29.9%, even as overall miles traveled for trucks has risen by tens of billions of miles,” said American Trucking Associations Chairman Dan England, chairman of C.R. England, Salt Lake City. “Both the trucking industry and consumers will suffer the impact of reduced productivity and higher costs. Also, groups that have historically been critical of the current hours of service rules won’t be happy since they will have once again failed to obtain an unjustified reduction in allowable daily driving time. Further, it is entirely possible that these changes may actually increase truck-involved crashes by forcing trucks to have more interaction with passenger vehicles and increasing the risk to all drivers.”
“Collectively, the changes in this rule will have a dramatic effect on the lives and livelihoods of small-business truckers. The changes are unnecessary and unwelcome and will result in no significant safety gains,” said Owner-Operators Independent Drivers Association Executive Vice President Todd Spencer. “Compliance with any regulation is already a challenge because everyone else in the supply chain is free to waste the driver’s time loading or unloading with no accountability.”
John Cutler, NASSTRAC’s legal counsel, said FMCSA’s new rules will adversely impact productivity for trucking companies and their shipper customers for little or no safety benefit. “Though FMCSA preserved the 34-hour restart provision, these changes dramatically increase the disruptiveness of such rest periods by mandating that they take place between one o’clock and five o’clock in the morning,” said Cutler. “The effect is that down time due to restarts will increase significantly, and many drivers will start driving on Monday mornings, forcing thousands of trucks onto our roadways in rush hour and dramatically increasing traffic congestion.”
Also of Interest »
I was a driver, got in an accident with a concrete divider and can't drive anymore. The company I worked for picked up their truck and when I asked where it was so I could have it looked it to find out what happened the company had know idea where the truck was. I now receive 2/3 of my original pay, tax free, live on food stamps and the state i live in is paying for my schooling to retrain me. Even if i hadn't had my accident I was going to leave trucking after 15 years because of the low pay and general BS. I feel sorry for you guys and girls that can't get out but the next time you are waiting on a shipper, receiver or just parked for the night add up all the hours you are away from home and multiply it by minimum wage and just see how much you should be making. You all be safe out there.
might as well quit.i got 5 trucks runing.i know its not gonna shut down the government.but i get so tried of playing these games.and people wonder why unempolyment is up.
Hey did the FMCSA ever consider the long delays us drivers have to put up with at shippers and consignees! Ihave had to sit for hours to get loaded and I HAD TO EAT THE TIME! I sit no pay. If we are there on time and have unreasonable waits we should recieve delay pay. THIS IS ONE OF THE MAIN REASONS WE MAY HAVE TO CHEAT ON LOGS.It is easy to sit on your ass in Washingtonand come up with rules but how about seeing what goes on with drivers and what the real world is like.If we have a 1oclock appt. We shouldn'tstill be there at 3,4,5 or longer. HOW ABOUT A RULE AGAINST THAT FSCMA!
This is what "Vote Getting" does to the general public, Public Citizen is the group that brought this whole thing on. And the corrupt politicians caved to them so they stay at the public trough longer. Its time to shut-down for awhile, truck drivers have "Rights" and we are letting the "Whores of Washington" slowly put us out of business. HOS had not been touched since the were written, within the last 7 years they have touched twice, and trust me the next time some dimwitted citizens group complains about trucking some "dumb" "Whore of Washington" will be looking to change the rules again. Time to show the "Whores", time to shut the continent down for a week. Not one truck to turn a wheel for a week, lets see how well Mr. LaHood and his cohorts do as "Billy Big Riggers", lets see how well the politicians do driving trucks and "Public Citizen" and its members do with no Gas at the pumps no food in the supermarket. Its our time now, we as drivers have to get together on this issue and get our concerns on the table, and the only way to get the "Whores of Washington" to hear us is to shut down. All those FMCSA Public Listening sessions were just a smoke screen for us drivers, the "Whores" think that we are all dumb as stones and can't read. Gentlemen it's time to take a stand and show them we can read and we can do something about their stupidity.
P.S. Ever take notice that politicians come into office for the first time as your average guy, and leaves as a millionaire/billionaire. ??????? start thinking
The hours of service that have been in place have been working fine and accidents have reduced. What I would like to see as a safety director for a trucking company is this: When a person gets their license (4 wheeler), they are not taught safety issues regarding driving around or near a commercial 18 wheeler. They preach safety to the commercial truck driver, but there are going to be accidents where the 4 wheeler is at fault because they are not knowledgeable concering blind spots, stopping distance, turning radius of an 18 wheeler. I have not been able to find any drivers handbook that has this information in it or a state that test in thesea areas. Maybe they need to include this information in the drivers handbooks and test on it before a person gets their license. Safety is everyones responsibility not just the commercial driver.
Know your place you lowly truck slaves. It is your job to drive the truck not make policy. Most of you are lucky to be driving and should kiss the ground I walk on just for allowing you to drive. You are lucky not to wear shackles and be sold between companies like the slaves before you. What do you want anyways? Do you want a livable wage, a reasonable home time, and the ability to plan your day as you need to? Seriously, if you even think about a strike or protest we will shut the whole industry down and you can go live in the streets. We'll see how you like it then.
B.H. Obama et. al.
December 29, 2011 at 10:34 am
when can we look forward to the next revision that is not needed?
I believe that trucking should come to a complete stand still
everyone parks there trucks and we help make the rules on the hours of service and make everyone think how everything got to the store shelves that they are buying,and how much waiting was involved for the Driver that went against his log clock and that the government would put there energy into making the rules for the shippers/receivers that they have no more then 1 hr to load a truck and 1 hr to unload so we could do more driving and less waiting that goes against our daily clock.
If they really wanted a good way to make things safe there is an easy answer in my opinion.They could allow drivers to take a two hour sleeper berth break and the remaining eight hours would have to be taken when the fourteen hours is up. The way the law is now you can not take a two hour sleeper break without it counting against your on duty time. I know of quite a few drivers who had to "push" themselves through a long day because they couldn't stop to take a two hour nap without it counting against them. These drivers of course had electronic log books. My company uses paper logs. So when I feel fatigued I take a two hour cat nap and I wake up feeling refreshed. I simply "back my log book up" so the two hour nap doesn't penalize me. When I take the remaining eight hours later on I show that I took the entire ten hours off. I don't understand why the paper pushers in Washington aren't smart enough to figure out the advantages of splitting the sleeper berth into a eight hour period and a two hour period. The advantage to me is obvious. It is about safety. Isn't that why we have the rules and regulations ? It seems to me the paper pushers don't care about drivers and safety. They are too busy trying to get votes and cash from the shippers and trucking companies.
and here is another good question, You can only use the 34 hour restart once a week? What moron came up with that? If your off 34 hrs twice in a week that is not good enough to restart your book but the first time is ok? freaking morons!
It is time for a revolt. All the truckers in this nation need to join forces and shut this nation down, it is time to gather in numbers and bring these idiots to their knees. All they are doing is placating to the soccer moms who cry about the big nasty trucks not realizing that everything she owns has been on a truck! And the idiots in Washington are making it harder and harder for anybody to survive because they get everything they want by taking everything we have...it is time to unite! The truckers in this nation need to have the balls to stand together...and be the new family of force on the block.
And when can we look forward to the next revision that is not needed?
Once again common sense plays no part of the rules our gov't sets for us. They always complicate the rules with some provision that makes us non compliant. How many ways are we supposed to count our hrs??
Huaaahhh,anything that impedes the progress for hard working people
is a huge triumph, an inconmensurable pleasure for parasites powerful politicians.Every month a new pseudolaw about trucking is issue anywhere.
Fuel was at $1.83 before current US Administration and no control over price of a gallon of diesel allowed price to soar to almost $6.00 a gallon in Los Angeles, California...
In 1st quarter profits of 2008, oil refineries boasted $93,000,000,000.00 (93 Billion)in three months...
Congress questioned the price and oil refineries said it was due to the two wars and the government gives oil refineries wind-fall money to make sure they are sucessful...
2008,2009,2010,2011 total increased profits are aproximately $1,000,000,000,000.00 (1 Trillion ) in the last four years...
$700,000,000,000.00 (700 Billion)saved the entire US from financial colapse, the stock market, car manufacturers and all the banks...
Leaves no money to circulate and the possibility for the economy to grow and being a global economy now China now has the money...
The current US Administration wants to print up another $450,000,000,000.00 (450 Billion) to jump start the economy...
This will only feed the oil refineries and create more inflation and prevent the US economy from getting out of the recession not to mention the value of a US dollar is less around the world...
Oh by the way this has been a triple dip recession and its not getting any better...
Fuel price should not jump until you have sold all your fuel at a fair profit and need to buy more bulk from a gas station.
The same oil refineries are who own truck stop fueling stations and they have doubled in the last four years and some if not all have filed for bankruptcy protection...
Write Congress and tell them enough is enough, Johnny Rotten says stop corporate greed, impose new laws, have watch dogs, punish people who cook the books in stocks, make banks responsile for housing melt down, price gouging or price fixing, outlaw spectulators for oil refineries...
you can also write to me and I will forward the letters to Congress in Washington for free...
Johnny at:
oneidjak72001@yahoo.com
My intention is not to offend anyone and I do realize Windows has whats called a back door for authorities but I don't see anything wrong in voicing my opinion...
It is easy to set in a chair in an office and wright what truckers need to do especially when you have never been in a truck. but what happens when you get in a truck and try to perfore to the rules set forth is a great loss of respect for the ones makeing the rules. Try being a driver with rising fuel cost, some one always telling you your rates are to high, and the law always thinking of new ways to slow you down.
I agree with the previous statements. Washington is out of control with there power, with the help of the big trucking companies who lobbied for all of the new regulations. We need to Occupy Washington with 18 wheelers!!
These are the idiots who can't balance a budget, create jobs, or do anything that is good for country. You think they know what is good for trucking? It's time for the reveloution to start, and a good start might be with the truckers in this nation. Enough is enough. Make laws just to get the warm fuzzy feeling that we are doing something. This is the most stupid thing I've seen. The old hours of service rules worked fine. Splitting sleeper berth into two periods is now I run.
This was a predictable outcome, a mandatory response to a lawsuit that does nothing to address the issues that cause the most truck accidents. We will still have to deal with dangerously irresponsible automobile drivers and trucking customers who casually waste our rested and wakeful driving time. The one and a half year compliance delay gives Congress ample time to codify a final set of rules custom tailored for either the safety advocates or the ATA depending on who provides the most campaign donations. Bravo once again gentlemen. You have done nothing to make this a better job. It is no wonder that with millions now unemployed almost no one would consider driving a truck for a living.
23 years in the seat and every year the bureaucrats find a way to further this countries slide into 3rd world status. They have done nothing to help and everything to hinder the great economic powerhouse that America once was, it ssems almost like a conspiracy to destroy this country. Oppress productivity through inane and clueless regulations, discourage and demoralize the working class with high taxes, fees, penalties and fines along with the overburdensome regulatory climate and qualifications to enter a field/career that is vital both to our national economic interests as well as our national security intersts and you have a recipe that is now coming to fruition, in a word, disaster and total economic collapse. We have been quiet too long my brother and sisters of the road, the time to rise up is now! We have the power but do we have the will to do what is needed and called for at this time in our country? I do not know the answer to that question but I believe unless we do this nation will slide into irrelevance and the concept of American exceptionalism will be a shell that future historians will point to as an example of a peoples apathy despite being blessed with the greatest of freedoms.
It seems to me that they just want to make are jobs more difficult to do. If they make it more confusing more difficult the more mistakes drivers will make the more revenue they collect in violations. There going to force more Independents and Owner Operators out of the industry destroying more small business in this country which seems to me is what this governments agenda has been since thieve been elected It has nothing to do with safety like the Mexican cross border issue What’s Next
time for trucking rates to increse
We have people making rules that know what is best for us that have not driven a truck, I know when I need to rest and these rules make me more tired trying to comply with them.
I have to agree with Gordon A. on this one if everyone would ride in one of these big rigs for just one week and and see what goes on with these 4 wheelers they would see who is at fault 95% of the time when it comes to an accident. Sometimes I wish we had on board cameras so that the court systems could see how a car comes up off the ramp and then runs out of a merge area and then continues up the shoulder and then decides to take your right away from you and he is in your blind spot and guess what happens next ACCIDENT and who gets blamed the TRUCK DRIVER. or the car is doing 90 in the hammer lane and decides it wants to get off at an exit and they are only 50 ft from the exit and you are beside them and here they come take four lanes and cut you off you slame on the brakes and car hits you in rear or they hit you in the front they
still want to blame the truck driver. Its crazy. If every vehicle on the road had to pay the taxes that the Trucking industry had to pay to use the highways maybe there wouldnt be as many cars on the roads. Trucking industry makes no money as it is with the brokers taking more out of the loads than they should, and rising fuel costs, and with that all the expenses go up you make no money as it is. Come on Mr. WAKE UP
my 25 year old son works at a security job he just started at $16.the only thing that will ever help the us trucker is for them to be reclassified as non exempt on the overtime rules of the 1934 national fair labor standards act, that created overtime for most U.S. workers, working over 40 hours per week.
the american trucker has been denied this benefit since its inception because they are involved in interstate (crossing state lines)commerse, those truckers who operate in intrastate (within a state) are covered under the act. but many of those are denied because the rule can be applied if there is a probability of them being used in interstate transportation, and most companies are operating accross state lines.
in 1934 these rules where not that bad because the truck driver was not under the direct controll of the carrier.
The carriers from 1934 thru the early 2000s, had no real way of tracking what a driver was doing or where he was at, so no way to verify what the company was paying for, but in todays world they have the ability for realtime data as to location and action of the truck.
As drivers, we know that by law we are supposed to log all time at shippers and recievers and other time that is used to comply with our job requirments.
We also know that the companies pay by mileage. these plans where designed to deter the driver from logging their acutual working down time to save the available hours for miles, the mecanisim we are paid by, and even then, many of the carriers pay by the household movers guide which we all know cuts the pay by 7-10%, because while they want us to be paid by these routings they do not want us to run these routes because of the time we would loose, on all those back roads.
i am in my 35th year of trucking and i started at the very beginning of deregulation, and have saw (for the most part) the decline of drivers earning status with the cut throat rates that prevail in today,s enviroment.
At the beginning of my carreer a driver earned 2-3x what he could make in a local factory, and today many factory jobs pay better than a long haul driver. and he gets overtime after 40 hours
there is not a shortage of drivers, there is a shortage of drivers who will work for the prevailing wages that most companies are willing to pay and the lack of freedom that is available in todays industry.
we have seen companies create there version of the so called owner operator, with there lease to own plans. which in reality is a joke. ( if the company is the owner and you are leasing it , you are not a real owner operator) that allowes them to keep from paying benefits to the drivers that are required by law, the head of the national trucking association, and his company, listed in the article is a prime example of this.
When and only when, trucks and drivers are paid for there time not there miles will the industry turn around.
These cost would be deriled by the companies and their crony politicians as causing inflation. but truly the cost would bring about a sudden inpact on driver employment, and wages, resulting in more tax revinue for the taxers, better wages for the drivers and the families they serve, and maybe a little less profit for the large corperations that we haul for.
i am near the end of my carreer, and all the hour rules they make will be as effective as the ones from the early 1930's.
Drivers will always look for ways to manage the time and money we earn, when and only when we are paid for the actual hours we are at work, will the true hours of service regulations be complied with by truck drivers.
iv not been in trucking long but from what i here its a bunch of bs and if the law looks at the 4 wheelers you will see that theres the prob there all texting and on the phone and not paying no attention to there surroundings but thats alright theres going to be a trucker shut down it needs to happen very soon
Listen folks,
I'll concede that most accidents involving trucks are caused by auto drivers. And I'll concede that many auto drivers are idiots. And I'll even concede that we can't live without trucks and the truckers who deliver almost everything we consume. And I'll tell you that I'm very considerate of truck drivers (I don't tailgate, I'm aware of blindspots, I'll let anyone change lanes in front of me if they signal, and I won't pace a trailer so the trucker has room for an emergency maneuver).
But I won't concede the road to you. Like it or not, you guys have to share the road with the rest of us. I'm tired of truckers tailgating me, not letting me in if I signal, and generally being rude on the road. Like it or not, you get tired, too. Red Bull and 5-Hour Energy drinks are no substitute for sleep and rest. I'd rather that you be alert to the idiots on the road instead of making believe that you own the road and they don't belong on them.
There's no load, no job, no delivery that can't wait another hour if it saves someones life.
One final note to all of my fellow truckers. THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A BETTER TIME TO JOIN OOIDA!!!!!
AGAIN Mr LaHood has shown his ineptness. This has all the markings of trying to fix something that ISN'T BROKE. When law enforcement steps up and says not to mess with the current rules, that should speak VOLUMES. But not to the morons at DOT and FMCSA. It is apparent to me that this is simply an attempt to JUSTIFY thier jobs.
I am the owner operator of 10 trucks and refrigerated trailers(female Owner). We try to follow the rules of the road and accidents have been reduced greatly. However the rules for trucking and rules for airlines are not the same and the liability is comparably the same.Now. What is the difference in cargo planes and cargo on trucks? Come on they are maned by humans and hauling products(not passengers) from point A to point B.
I don't know who makes all the rules but they do not own trucks and do not realize the time driving and waiting to be loaded is a great factor in hours of service.
Thanks. Needed to vent. We are trying to give good service and make a living but HOS limits the process.
Do office personel run out of hours?
janice Wilder/jwfoods
La Hood. I will say it again. Your an idiot. when 85% to 88% ( govt findings) of car truck accidents are caused by the car driver how are these new HOS rule going to change that? ONE day La Hood and the rest of you ignorant boobs will get a rude awaking. You obviously HAVE NEVER BEEN ASSOCIATED WITH A TRUCK SHUT DOWN but your soon going to be. The Trucking industry is getting sick and tired of this BS and you and your cronies have been pushing on us.
Tell me again Mr Ray Lahood how this change is really going to reduce accidents.
You ignore the facts. You refuse to listen to any one with a CDL or recent driving experience.You refuse to talk to those your rules will effect.. You obviously have no clue .
Could it be that to come up with a simple solution would seem like your being wasted in your position.??
You Have ignored qth
This new rule is RIDUCUOUS AND NON SENSE AND LEADS TO GREATER UNPRODUCTIVITY.
Once again the FMCSA has proven to all of us in the trucking industry that they have absolutely no clue how the trucking industry works. This is going to cut a drivers productivity and his ability to make a decent living. Drivers wage will have to increase significantly, freight rates will have to be increased, cost of raw materials and consumer goods will increase significantly, and worst of all many good drivers will leave trucking. What a bunch of morons.
I just wish the people that are trying to make rules for us to opperate by at least new what the inside of a truck looked like and just how hard it is for a team to opperate by the rules they have provided, I will never understand how a minority group can make a government office jump through hoops that the FMCSA has been jumping through the past 10 to 12 years!
I'm a firm believer in the old hos rule, 10 on 12 off, you know the one that worked for years... Well, in steps the Government and a bunch of do gooders that doon't know a gear shift from a mud flap, and they're going to tell us whats best for us... Not a single one of them has ever driven OTR, or even across the street in a truck.. But they know whats best because somebody they met in a bar told them... If you've never been in a truck, then you shouldn't be allowed to make the rules for them.. I bet most of them,(rule makers ) can't even spell truck... Just remember one thing, that here in America, WE Have The Best Congress and Senate That Money Can Buy......
Mr Lahood should have some experience at driving a Big Rig for a living and also should have ownership experience. The Shippers, Brokers and Recievers are the ones that need desiplining not the truck owners and Drivers This new rule is redicuoious to say the least,
Ok... I get the reason behind it. I realize normal people get up and go down with the sun, but what if I have gotten up at 3am my whole adult life.
I had a farm, 4 kids, and a spouse to all deal with before breakfast. Now I drive a truck cuz it fits the schedule I keep and pays well. I normally drive/ work from 3am to 3 pm, wind down til 5pm, and sleep very well. Now I'm gonna be forced after years of this schedule to change it to fit in with a 34 that has to have 2 1am to 5am periods. Now, when I come off a 34 I'm gonna already be up for 2 hours before I start work, do my 12 hour day, & get done at 5pm. So really they just forced me to have a 14 hr day every week.... GREAT!
so, let me see if i have this straight. now because i have been "mandated" to sleep for two nights between 1am and 5am, i'm going to be a safer more alert driver the next seven days. were do these idiots come from?
To a driver, time is money. I'm sure most drivers will gladly comply. Now, let's do some studies on how this will affect them economically. Then, let's find a solution that provides the whole industry a reason to do their safest best. Regardless of the intent, this legislation will only become oppressive if it isn't complimented by additional legislation that deals with the remuneration of the people who are to do this job by the book. When do we have enough rules in place to satisfy those who want to control everything? On the other hand, look back 25 years and judge how different the industry was then.
THE NEW TRUCK DESIGN AND NEW TYPE OF DRIVER!!!THE TRUCK HAS NO SLEEPER,IT HAS NO AM/FM/SIRIUS,HAS NO GUAGES,NO CB,NO GPS,HAS AUTOMATIC TRANS,THE SEAT IS A TOILET,YOUR HANDS ARE DUCT TAPED TO THE STEERING WHEEL,THE DRIVER WEARS BLINDERS (YOU KNOW,THOSE THINGS HORSES WEAR ON THEIR EYES SO THAT THEY ONLY SEE STRAIGHT AHEAD)THIS ALL HAS TO BE APPROVED BY A DOT OFFICIAL BEFORE YOU START YOUR TRIP!!UNDER THE NEW HOS RULES WHEN YOUR 8 HR BREAK COMES UP,DOT DRAGS YOU OUT OF THE TRUCK TO TAKE A 30 MIN.NAP ON A PICNIC TABLE AND WHEN YOUR 11HRS OR YOUR 34HR RESET COMES UP A DOT OFFICIAL WILL BE THERE TO DRAG YOU OF TO A MOTEL TO GET YOUR REST!!!I FEEL LIKE I'M GOING TO BE TREATED LIKE A 3 YEAR OLD,I'M 57 AND I THINK I KNOW WHEN I NEED TO GO TO SLEEP!!!!!!!
the new HOS rules suck!!!!i'm home weekends,now i have to run out my 70hrs and do my 34 on the road!!!!the government don't care about the american truck driver!!!the mexicans are coming in to take our jobs,all the big trucking companies already have terminals in mexico!!they can hire mexican drivers cheaper!!that is why the HOS was changed so thet we can all be run out of ajob here in the US!!
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